How much do you think this factor influenced the final outcome of the Great Council of 101?

2024.11.26 19:41 Emergency-Weird-1988 How much do you think this factor influenced the final outcome of the Great Council of 101?

I am talking about the king's own preferences on the matter, that is, his own preferences on once candidate over the others.
I feel like this is a very under-discussed point in all the posts and publications I've seen regarding the Great Council of 101 and personally I think it was a silent but decisive factor for Viserys ultimate win.
Obviously I'm not going to pretend that many of the great lords of Westeros didn't voted for one candidate or the other based on their personal interests or what they thought would have been the most beneficial for them, we have obvious examples in people like Lord Corlys Velaryon or Lord Boremund Baratheon that were Rhaenys and Laenor's more addamant and powerful defenders, the fact that they were also their family is a mere coincidence of course, BUT I think that the king's preferences are a factor that changes everything when those preferences are public knowledge, especially when we're talking about a king as popular and well-loved as Jaehaerys was, because while its true that the King sought to appear impartial, by doing things like not attending the Great Council in person, not making statements in favor of one candidate or another and pledging to respect the decision of the council whatever that might be (something that legally speaking he was not obligated to do) the truth is that both we as readers as well as most lords of Westeros can at least infer with a certain degree of certainty which was the king's favorite candidate and his opinion on the matter, if only based on his previous choice of Baelon over Rhaenys.
And I think that this can't just be considered "mere speculation" on my part when in-universe we have maesters themselves speculating that the reason (or at least one of the reasons) why the Starks, one of the great houses of Westeros, supported the succession rights of Princess Rhaenys Targaryen and her son Laenor Velaryon during the Great Council was because they were upset with Jaehaerys for past problems with him, thus inferring that they did it to spite Jaehaerys, and of course it would only be a "spite" if Rhaenys or Laenor winning it's something that general public of lords in attendance knows or believes is something that Jaehaerys himself doesn't want to happen.
So that brings me to a couple of things:

Just as we heard of at least one important Lord of the realm voting for a certain candidate not out of personal conviction or preference but based on the king's opinion on the matter (in this case to annoy him) not only is it not crazy to think of the opposite, some important Lord of the realm voting for a certain candidate because he believes it is what the king wants, but it seems quite likely to me that happened, obviously its not like we are going to have an answer on the matter, but we can always talk about it.
One very important factor to be able to determine if this is true or not, is the following: how were the votes counted? By this I mean, was Lord Stark's vote worth the same as Lord Cuy's despite the fact that House Stark rules one of the constituent regions of the seven kingdoms while House Cuy is a vassal of a vassal and is clearly lower in the "social ladder" than Lord Stark? or was there some distinction in the votes? Was more "value" given to the vote of the most powerful and important Lords? Or was each vote worth the same? We have no answer to that either, only speculation, although if the rumored result of the Great Council is true then I think is fair to say that each vote was worth the same, especially if we consider that of the confirmed voters for one or the other candidate the Rhaenys/Laenor faction actually has more than those known to Viserys and they are not just any Lords, they are some of the most important in the realm such as Lord Stark, Lord Baratheon, Lord Velaryon (the richest in the realm), Lord Manderly and Lord Blackwood, so assuming that the result is true, I'm inclined to believe that it was so because of an overwhelming support for Viserys from not only some important lords of the realm such as the Lannisters, but also from lords of a lesser standing motivated by the idea of "respecting" what seemed to be the royal preferences, since unlike other more important lords even when offered with bribes or blackmail, they stood to win or lose less depending on who was elected, and maybe more than one of them voted for one candidate because their feudal lord did so (more than one northern house surely voted for Laenor just because Lord Stark did it) but I can't help but think that many others did it just because they considered that was Jaehaerys wish (and yeah, most likely it was)
Many of the "considerations" to the royal will (even if not made completely public) also make sense if we take into account that Jaehaerys was not only a popular and well-liked king, but also someone considered very intelligent, so surely from the point of view of many he "knew better" about what was best for the kingdom in terms of succession than most other people; so, that some group of lords used him as a reference when voting either out of respect to him, trying to win some royal favor for it or just because they consider that Jaehaerys knows what he's doing, is not to far-fetched.

And as a closing point I just want to add that the fact that there may be a "greater respect" for the king's preferences over succession and his "royal will" is something that is also present later in history in another important event: the Dance of the Dragons itself, while its true that some of the most "prominent" supporters of Rhaenyra and her faction were lords with whom some deal had to be negotiated in exchange for their support or because it suited them better for her to be the monarch (although the same can be said of the greens and Aegon) the truth is that we cannot ignore those instances of lords who aligned themselves with her and her faction for no other reason than her status as heir and the apparent respect for the royal will, not counting all the lords at the Red Keep that literally died for her claim, we also have her supporters of The Reach and taking into account that they had no personal benefit with Rhaenyra being queen, their feudal lord did not declare for her and given the position of the Hightowers they even had everything to be an "easy target" for the greens that they declared for her speaks of loyalty to Viserys will, and of course there are others like some of the riverlords that joined her, we can't forger about Lord Piper "I swore her my sword. I'm older now, but not so old that I've forgotten the words I said, and it happens I still have the sword" so it can't be denied that more than one supporter of the blacks supported them simply because she was the heir designated by the king, or what is the same, out of respect for the royal will, so in a similar sense isn't it possible that more than one Lord (maybe even several) voted for Viserys in the Great Council of 101 solely based on what seemed to be the tacit royal will on the matter at that time? and while I doubt that Viserys was hated since despite what came after his death his reign in general can be called "peaceful" at least in the sense that while it lasted there was no conflict, Jaehaerys would undoubtedly be much more loved and respected by the nobility than Viserys was and I dare to say more than any other Targaryen king ever, so if we know that there were people willing to even die to fulfill Viserys will, is it really to far-fetched to belive that there were also people willing to do something simpler than going to war such as just giving an anonymous vote in compliance with what they thought it was Jaehaerys will?
I rest my case.
And you, what do you think about it?
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2024.11.26 19:41 zagonem49 Help understand GAP Insurance

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2024.11.26 19:41 Jting1993 Are these white panels asbestos ?

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2024.11.26 19:41 Flaming_tulip Witch Hazel

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2024.11.26 19:41 OptimalRaspberry5472 Really good battery for a gaming laptop

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Screen was on for 12 hours-ish
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2024.11.26 19:41 NDVGuy Recommendations suitable for a fifteen-minute walk?

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2024.11.26 19:41 chetonovoe That damned space fort

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2024.11.26 19:41 222_BPM Why doesn't arcane surge work on Infernus 3?

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2024.11.26 19:41 Unhappy_Geologist_94 Epic should really make updating less time consuming on PCs

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I am tired of Fortnite updates at the moment, every single fking week there is one, hooray more content? no, the Weeknd's back in the shop, ugh
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2024.11.26 19:41 powertrip22 433(2) Tactic Write Up-Attacking Threat and Difficult to Counter

This is a write up of my 433(2) tactics. I've been playing since fifa 12, currently around 10-12 wins per WL and sitting in D2.
In past fifas I loved the false 9 and the 4312, but they removed the false 9 formation and this fifa you need width, so I workshopped my own tactics that have been going well for me. I This year I feel that if you're too narrow, you will get crushed by their center backs, but if your wingers are too wide you don't get many passing options, so I took some modern tactics and tried implementing some of them to great effect.
Tactic Code: ScqSxWmet&C
Build up style: Short passing(though I think balanced would work)
Defensive Approach: Balanced (though I think high would work too)
https://preview.redd.it/dl4hs5oxqa3e1.png?width=1540&format=png&auto=webp&s=55eb3d534b83207ce3b280bbb128ff565afa56f9
This is how I run the player roles. Overall. the goal on defense is to have the two center mids supported by 3 center backs (typically I have my CDM on center-half but I am trying palacios who has holding++), and the attacking wingbacks apply pressure to force their offence inward where I have the most support.
On attack, when you win the ball the goal is to have as many passing options, and often times this results in passing to a wingback and then to a CM, who pushes forward to break their line. The ST as a poacher should push their CBs backward and keep them preoccupied or exploit any gaps they have. By having both wingers set to inside forward and roaming, you find they can come centrally enough to pull the wingbacks in and make space for overlapping Attacking Wingback runs.
Overall, this means you usually have an option or two that can increase the attacking threat, and if you happen to lose the ball they have two center mids to go through while the wingbacks apply pressure and three CBs to push past. This does mean yielding some space to the corner of your defensive box, which can be dangerous with finesse shots, but I just apply as much pressure as possible and continue to push them down the line or backwards, no cutting in.
https://preview.redd.it/k5xviwpisa3e1.png?width=1470&format=png&auto=webp&s=49b3cf9675cb3d1519617b090730555317329dce
As for the players, you have a lot of freedom here, since there is so many passing options you can play skillfully or brute force. But my recommendations:
Goalie: anyone who works well for you, but I like sweeper keepers since people try the kickoff glitch so much.
CBs: Anyone big strong and quick. I really liked IF Gvardiol since he can pass so well. Just make sure they are on the same role since you do not want them creating an uneven back line and playing people onside.
LB/RB: Very important role, get as good of attackers as you can. I evo'd Weah and he is instrumental in this role, but whipped pass can deliver some great crosses when needed.
CDM: I like an interceptor or strong tackler, since a lot of people are going to try to slip in passes behind your back line or carry through. Thuram was amazing here.
CM: B2B defensively solid players, do not give them an attacking role. I like them to be able to attack, but I want to choose when I carry progressively, I dont want them caught out.
LW/RW: Good passers and dribblers. Hazard would be insane if i could afford him. I like strong foot outside or 5* weak foot since they'll get so many across the body opportunities.
ST: Anyone who can get in behind and score, strength helps since they'll be battling the CBs.
That's pretty much it! Obviously I still lose games I don't think I should've but I think this sets me up for the most fun attacking I've played in a while. If you have any questions leave them in the comments and I'd be happy to answer.
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2024.11.26 19:41 klgangsteroop That's you

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2024.11.26 19:41 Disastrous_Host_8899 What’s that movie for you?

Other than Shakeela movies, please. (:
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